Marcus Hart (00:01.196)
Janet, officially welcome to the Transform You Live show. You are a licensed clinical social worker, trauma expert, and all around warrior for healthy relationships. Dropping wisdom on Instagram and outlets like Dex... Dexchill? Dropping... You you have been featured in Women.com as well, you know, and there's another word I cannot pronounce, but that outlet is very incredible too.
So I'm hyped to kick off the unseen change with real talk for our survivors, hope seekers and chaos fighters and un-max some of these hidden signs. So are you ready?
Janet Bayramyan (00:37.313)
I'm ready. Great to be here.
Marcus Hart (00:39.702)
All right. All right, Janet, let's get raw and unmasked the early red flags of domestic abuse that most folks miss. Do you think domestic abuse starts with a punch, but your work says it often begins with a whisper, sudden moves that feel normal at first?
Janet Bayramyan (00:57.227)
Yeah, so typically no. I mean, if you go out on a date with somebody and on the first date, you know, they punch you. We know not to go back to that person. mean, that's kind of the typical response. So often in those initial early stages, you don't see overt signs like that. You actually see oftentimes a very, very charming
Marcus Hart (01:08.94)
Yeah, exactly.
Janet Bayramyan (01:25.899)
individual, a very classy individual, maybe an individual with a lot of power in their lives, like maybe they are CEOs of their own companies and things like that. So you don't see like overt, necessarily abusive behavior. You actually see somebody that maybe appears to have their lives quite together, actually. So in the beginning,
You know, you don't necessarily see certain things like that. You see somebody that actually is trying to impress you and it's very impressive. I think some of the more covert signs, the lesser seen signs are maybe the individual is trying to move kind of quickly with you in a relationship. you know, they might.
Marcus Hart (02:11.896)
Mm-hmm.
Janet Bayramyan (02:15.011)
try to take you out almost every day, let's say, or they are moving really fast, like they want you to move in right away, right? Or they're saying, I love you so quickly. And again, in those experiences, it can feel very exciting, like, wow, this person has only known me for this amount of time, but they're already saying they love me. It must mean that we have this amazing connection. And so there can be a lot of misunderstandings with that.
Marcus Hart (02:46.67)
Yeah, I can definitely relate to that. I've seen that, you know, as we was talking on the other side in my own relationships, past relationships where, you know, someone would kind of speed up the relationship and then they would want to move in with me. And before you know it, we have these crazy things that start happening. You have talked about how these signs show up emotionally, socially, or even psychologically.
you know, maybe like a partner criticizing your friends or checking your phone too much. What's one normal behavior that actually is a red flag, something sneaky that could fool even the sharpest person?
Janet Bayramyan (03:29.825)
Yeah, I mean, some of the things that you just mentioned, right? Like if they're if they're starting to criticize the people in your life, your friends, your family, your coworkers, trying to get you to see them maybe in a different light or trying to really distance you and separate you. And if they say things like, well, if you loved me, then you would do this. If you cared about me, then you would do this like putting that level of pressure.
on you and let's just be very clear that's not love that's power and control they're trying to take over certain power over you. That's definitely a sign that you know you don't want to ignore and then.
taking away any other powers that you might have. So for example, if you really want to work and you love your job and they might say, don't worry about your job, quit your job, I'll take care of you. That's another form of control. They might be wanting to take financial control over you so that you don't necessarily have your own money or your ability to make your own money. So anytime if the individual is
presenting it as I'm just here to help you. I wanna support you. I wanna make your life easier when really the underlying desire is to take away something that could keep you feeling empowered. That is definitely something to take a note of as well.
Marcus Hart (04:57.154)
And that's true. know, love can be so blind and, you know, and then we oftentimes lose, you know, sight of the truth when our truth should be rooted in faith. There's a lot of people going to Google, you know, searching signs of toxic relationships or how to spot emotional abuse. How do these early signs like put downs or controlling when you see start to chip away at someone's self was sense of self?
Janet Bayramyan (05:28.117)
Yeah, well, it's unfortunate. I mean, when you hear certain types of statements like that, like, you're not smart, or you're you don't love me, you're not lovable to me, right? Like, that can really chip away at who you are. Because at that point, when you start hearing those statements from your relationship partner, you're already locked into that relationship. Typically, there's already
love there. There's typically a lot of, you know, enmeshment connection. You might be living together, your lives might be interconnected. So a lot of your belief system is in that person. So when you start hearing statements like that, it's not easy to just say like, I don't believe you. I don't know what you're talking about, right? Like, you're already so
in each other's lives and there's a lot of feeling and care there already. So it really does chip away at who you are because you start questioning like, well, yeah, am I stupid? Am I not smart? Am I not seeing things the right way? Am I I abusing them? Like this individual could turn things around and say, well, you're the one in the relationship, right? So you start really questioning
Marcus Hart (06:40.13)
Yeah.
Janet Bayramyan (06:45.889)
your behaviors, your sense of self, your intentions, who you really are, that can definitely start happening, unfortunately.
Marcus Hart (06:56.472)
Janet, must say I'm really enjoying how you are putting light in the shadows, showing us how these whispers turn into chains. So now let's talk about how this escalates and why it's so hard to break free even when you sense that something is off. Because victims, they often feel trapped, know, Janet, you know, but it ain't always physical bars. Folks, Googling, why do we...
people stay in abusive relationships or psychological effects of abuse. What are those invisible chains that, you know, seem like shame or fear or judgment that keep people stuck even before physical harm kicks in?
Janet Bayramyan (07:35.275)
Yeah, well look, what I need people to understand is that it is not black and white like that. Even though, let's say you're going through very, very terrible things in the relationship, the person is emotionally verbally abusive. Let's not even talk about the bigger abuse of sexual abuse or physical violence, right?
you likely care about that person. The individual likely has love and care and a deep desire for that individual to grow, right? So it's not black and white where you're where you can just like turn that love off, right? And then leave. It's not like that. It is so complicated because there is likely a part of you that sees the good.
in that individual that really hopes for that individual to change and to grow. So there's that aspect. Oftentimes just the love and the care that you feel for the individual keeps you locked in.
Other factors, of course, include if you have children with the individual, right? Like it's not just easy to just leave when you have kids. You have to figure out what you're going to do and what your life looks like and where you're going to go and how you're going to pay for things and how you can navigate taking your kid to school and all of their responsibilities. So it's not just easy to just walk away, particularly if you have children.
Marcus Hart (08:45.454)
Yeah.
Janet Bayramyan (09:04.715)
And you might also, if you have children, carry this belief of, well, it's going to be worse for my kid if I step away. It's going to create even more chaos for my kid if I step away. So you might even be dealing with maybe some of your own beliefs or preconceived notions around that. And then we talked about some of the other issues earlier. If your partner has taken over your finances,
then that makes it even triple quadruple times harder because then if you don't have family or supports, where are you going to go? How are you going to pay for a hotel room? How are you going to, you know,
Marcus Hart (09:35.298)
Yeah.
Janet Bayramyan (09:43.777)
figure out another living situation, right? Like that can also be very, very hard. So there is a lot of, would say if you get to the point where you are planning to leave, there is a lot of planning and logistics that you have to do as well as safety planning, you know, making sure that
you have things in place so that if you know in the event god forbid the other person tries to go after you you have a plan of how you're going to keep yourself safe how you're going to keep your child and your children safe too.
Marcus Hart (10:20.354)
Wow, you really laid it all out on the line there. You know, there's a lot of victim blaming. It is so common nowadays. And you got a chance to you still do to this day work with survivors in their communities for those searching how to help a friend in a toxic relationship or healthy relationship boundaries. What's one critical support system? Maybe a friend, faith or therapy that can.
be the thing that makes a great early intervention.
Janet Bayramyan (10:53.059)
You know, this is gonna sound so overly simplified, but I think it's the number one tool that you can give somebody in your life that's going through something like this. And it's active listening. Really, really actively listening to your friend.
I say that because so often friendships, you want to just go in and like rescue that person. You want to go in and validate and say like, you're right, your partner's horrible. I've hated them for a long time. You gotta leave, let's leave, right?
Marcus Hart (11:21.39)
Mm-hmm.
Janet Bayramyan (11:31.529)
And again, maybe that person is not there yet. Maybe that person is not at the point where they are just ready to pick up and leave. They may seem like it. They may be sharing a lot of things that they don't like about their partner, but that doesn't necessarily mean that they're at the point where it's time for them to go. So the simple act of just listening and creating space for your friend is so powerful because
Marcus Hart (11:50.04)
Right.
Janet Bayramyan (11:59.769)
then they know they can come to you and talk to you. And I think the second skill that is so very important, which again, I know it sounds so simplified, is to show your support no matter what. And this is what I say to my clients, I will support you no matter what decision you make. And I'm very real with my clients. say, I may not agree with every decision. I may not.
want you to stay in this relationship but if you choose to stay I'm going to support you 100 % and I'm still going to be there for you and I'm still going to listen and talk to you about what you're going through in this relationship.
That is a very important skill because your friend will need to know that you support them no matter what decision you make. Because if they feel like you will only support them if they leave, you're kind of isolating them too, if you think about it. So active listening, showing curiosity about what they're going through, and then supporting them without judgment, no matter what choice they make.
Marcus Hart (12:55.694)
You
Marcus Hart (13:09.058)
man, Janet, you're giving our family tools to see what's hidden and act with love. How about we just wrap this up with how survivors and those who love them can break free and find hope. You walk through your own trauma, which gives you mad cred to guide others for folks searching, healing from narcissistic abuse or breaking free from toxic relationships. What's the biggest single?
hardest truth you faced in your own journey that now is the gasoline to help people powered or will help you be on your mission to empower others.
Janet Bayramyan (13:50.475)
Yeah, there's probably so much. mean, I know for me personally, I personally kind of hit a breaking point where I just said to myself, I can't live like this anymore. Living like this, making me feel so miserable, so sad, so depressed. And, and essentially it was like my rock bottom, you know, so it might mean that
Marcus Hart (14:16.078)
Right.
Janet Bayramyan (14:19.403)
If it's not you, somebody in your life may need to hit that bottom for them to realize they need to make a change or start going to therapy or really talking to someone about what they're going through. I think that was definitely a big catalyst for me. And I think the next thing that really helped me was just kind of holding on to hope that there could be a new tomorrow.
that maybe tomorrow might still be hard, maybe things don't change obviously overnight, but.
There could be hope for a new beginning or a new life or a new vision for a different kind of life. So if you can do your best to hold on hope that there is something much better for you on the other side of this, I really recommend doing your best holding on to that. Or if you have a friend that really believes that for you, or if you're in therapy, if your therapist really believes that for you, really hold on to that feeling and hold on to that
relationship because that can also help carry you through to the other side for sure.
Marcus Hart (15:32.91)
It's definitely opening up some old memories and the way I transitioned through a lot of those dangerous relationships. You gave us some practical advice, some real good insight here. We've been practical all day.
you know, let's get even more practical for our survivors and advocates. What's one actionable step, you know, maybe a life audit or setting the boundary they could take today to start reclaiming their self-worth and building a healthy relationship? And maybe tell us a little bit about any, you know, way people can get in touch with you and any therapy services or resources you got.
Janet Bayramyan (16:21.527)
Yeah, so I'm located in Southern California. I'm in Los Angeles, California. So if you want to learn more about my services, my company is called Road to Wellness Therapy. So you can go to roadtowelness.co and find my information there. I'm also on Instagram and TikTok at Therapy with Janet B. So a lot of my resources are there as well. I would say
Marcus Hart (16:37.838)
Yeah.
Janet Bayramyan (16:49.509)
One thing that I think, again, I think is a little bit oversimplified and underrated, but I think it's actually very powerful is educating yourself. Because if you're not ready to leave the relationship, if you're kind of at a point where you're questioning the relationship, but you're sort of unsure, is this relationship toxic? Is this relationship abusive or not? I'm not really sure. don't know. Educate yourself. Read books on
what abusive relationships might look like. Read books on codependency, read books on toxic traits, gaslighting, things like that, so that you can just have a better knowledge on what do these things look like, and then you can almost do like an assessment of your life. Am I experiencing this in my personal life or not? Educating yourself.
I don't care what stage of life you're in, when you can educate yourself, that is one way to really hold on to yourself and hold on to your power. And then I think the next step is often to ask for help. So that might mean...
Marcus Hart (17:53.528)
Yeah.
Janet Bayramyan (18:00.555)
working with a therapist, that might mean working with a coach, whatever avenue works best for you, I highly encourage taking that next step. And the beautiful thing about therapy is that it's confidential and you do not have to tell anyone about it. You don't have to tell your partner, you don't have to disclose it. So if you want to start sort of thinking about and exploring your life and really questioning certain things about life,
Marcus Hart (18:13.72)
Mm-hmm.
Janet Bayramyan (18:28.545)
You can start talking to a therapist, getting sort of an unbiased opinion on some of the things that you're going through. So I would also highly recommend those two things as almost like a first step.
Marcus Hart (18:42.782)
That last part is so powerful. Therapy is definitely a good way to find faith in renewal. And it helps you through the trauma and it helps you to unlock things about yourself you didn't really knew was there to help you find new passions, perhaps, especially with coaching, finding new passions.
It's very important for post-trauma and also while you go on through trauma. So what's one question that you ask yourself daily to stay grounded in your purpose and help others break the cycle of abuse?
Janet Bayramyan (19:23.551)
One question I ask myself, like for me personally or for my clients? Yeah, so I am very blessed and lucky that I'm not in an abusive situation now, so I don't have to ask myself very hard questions like that. in the stage that I'm in right now, I think a big question I ask myself is,
Marcus Hart (19:27.222)
Yeah, for you.
Marcus Hart (19:43.245)
Enough.
Janet Bayramyan (19:49.855)
Do I feel grounded right now or do I feel like I'm avoiding or do I feel distant from myself? Do I feel checked out? The reason why I ask that is because our body sort of
gives us information that maybe even our minds are not ready for. So if I'm not feeling grounded, I might feel in my body like anxious or shut down, different things like that. So I asked myself that question because if my body is feeling anxiety, that means that maybe there's something I need to look into a little bit more deeply. I also asked myself, am I
avoiding something. That's an important question because if there is something that I'm avoiding then there's something hard or challenging in my life that maybe I'm not ready to look at. So I would say those might be some of the questions that I can do a little bit of like self-assessment on on the daily.
Marcus Hart (20:51.394)
Yeah, excellent. Janet, you dropped some straight fire today and this work is very helpful for not only for those out there, but for me and for those who are still on their recovery journey, transitioning.
You're spot on, you you're empowering our family out there to spot these unseen change and take actions. So, you know, I'd like to close with, you know, with that and, you know, I really thank you, you know, so much for joining us today and coming on board.
Janet Bayramyan (21:35.021)
Thank you. was a pleasure. so glad that this was helpful to others.
Marcus Hart (21:40.459)
Excellent.
